HRC Makes the Comparison: Stoner vs. Rossi

02/07/2012 @ 4:17 pm, by Jensen Beeler36 COMMENTS

HRC Makes the Comparison: Stoner vs. Rossi stoner rossi inforgraphic HRC twitterIt may still be the pre-season, but the banter regarding MotoGP on Twitter is certainly getting us ready for the start of the 2012 MotoGP Championship. Sending out a simple infographic this morning with the message, “this picture says it all,” HRC’s official Twitter account posted some interesting statistics that compared Repsol Honda rider Casey Stoner to Ducati Corse’s Valentino Rossi.

Breaking down Stoner’s win percentage over the past five years, the results of course paint an interesting picture. Of course the image “didn’t say it all” as the reaction on Twitter is about what you’d expect from a world widely divided by international boundaries. This of course lead to the image’s immediate removal, but alas nothing truly dies in the digital age.

In case you aren’t already aware, Valentino Rossi is a nine-time World Champion, and also happens to be the favorite son the of MotoGP Championship. Casey Stoner on the other hand…well, the Australian has at best a tumultuous relationship with the public. Naturally, backlash ensued, and HRC finally removed the graphic from its Twitter account.

Asserting that it was all in good fun and simply pointing out some statistics about the last five years, HRC surely was trying to bolster Stoner’s record, and remove the Repsol Honda rider from the “Most Underrated” list in MotoGP — a hard thing to do, even on the heels of a World Championship.

Is Casey a force to be reckoned with in MotoGP? Absolutely. Has a new dawn of riders entered MotoGP? Certainly. Has Rossi’s complete domination of premier-class racing been challenged by riders like Stoner, Lorenzo, and Pedrosa? Only a fool would say no. Does Rossi still have a rabid pack of fans inside and outside of the MotoGP paddock? You bet.

Commenting on HRC’s graphic, Rossi’s response to the matter was interesting. “eh eh,very easy compare the numbers between me and Stoner from 2006,when I won already 5 champs and 53 races mgp,” tweeted Rossi. Here’s the question though, do past laurels count for anything on race day? While we already have our favorite response so far, leave yours in the comments.

Source: Twitter (Original Post Removed)

Comment:

  1. 76 says:

    This just created a months worth (At least) of procedure reviews and meetings for those involved at Honda/HRC. Then after they figure that out the policy will go company wide with another months worth of meetings and instruction on proper procedure.

  2. I think injuries are worth a mention when looking at the comparison

  3. Riccardo says:

    Preferential treatment by Dorna and Michelin plus having the best bikes ever are worth a mention too.

  4. Steve says:

    Whats wrong with stating facts ?
    Rossi’s response to the matter was interesting. “eh eh,very easy compare the numbers between me and Stoner from 2006,when I won already 5 champs and 53 races mgp
    The comparison is only from 2006 as that is when Stoner came into MotoGP. Therfore there cannot be a comparison before that date. Rossi obviously bit on that one !
    The comparison was “pinched” from an article in Australian Motor Cycle News.

  5. @Steve – nothing is wrong with stating facts, except, well,… read the hyper link in the article above that points to @MotoMatters comment.

    HRC backfire?

    HRC low-side?

  6. CLB says:

    so, we compare from 2006, then we must compare from 2005 backwards. Every champ has their time in the sun. sometimes the sun gives you a full day and sometimes it shines for just a moment (Hayden).

    So, Stoner is the best rider of anything on two wheels right now. Give him his rights… but without a personality like Rossi, the millions of fans that watch would be elsewhere.

    Rossi is the king… but Stoner has a better winning percentage right now and may continue that streak. That rest is upto those willing to throw their life in front of one or the other to defend their turf. Me, I am hoping rossi can make it back to the top, but if not, then good racing will suffice and we’ll have then two great champions… Rossi and Stoner.

    Cheers, now get some sleep!

  7. remus37 says:

    With a winter season too long, I guess shit-stirring is hard to resist just to have something to talk about, even for the mightiest of the mighty in Motogp (HRC).

    I just hope that the person who tweeted this, was not required to commit ‘seppuku’ by the HRC board…

  8. Wolf says:

    Hehehahheh… i don’t mind this pole. Numbers are universal, but have to agree a little with Rossi, he was beyond halfway when the pole starts. Easy to rig a pole by doing such things.
    Never the less… from 2006, it’s valid.
    2 things though…. no offence, but let’s see a pole on how many cry-baby sessions there have been since then.
    (hehehahha… you never know, it may still be close, but there’s an amusing pic circulating around the net for a reason :)
    ….and secondly, you wrote it best up top.
    “Valentino Rossi is a nine-time World Champion, and also happens to be the favorite son the of MotoGP Championship. Casey Stoner on the other hand…well, the Australian has at best a tumultuous relationship with the public.”
    Cheers,
    – WOLF- (in Australia)

  9. remus37 says:

    I also find it ironic that most of Stoner’s number were achieved on the Ducati, not the HRC bike :) Not a good way to gloat me thinks…

  10. AC says:

    Stoner is a great racer but the guy is a dick. I’ve seen the fan treatment from both Stoner and Rossi and it’s not even comparable. I’ll take the guy who can win and still be appreciative of the people who support him.

  11. Someone at HRC wanted a laugh, but the legions of yellow-clad fools that only think there’s one rider in MotoGP all missed the point of the comparison.

    Looks like it’s a sore point for Vale, especially as his mind games no longer work with the new kids on the block (three WCs between George and Casey tell you that much.)

    As for Rossi’s fan interaction, I’ve still got a nagging feeling that it’s all as much of a show as his old GP-winning celebratory antics…

  12. Beary says:

    @AC
    Rossi was a great champion. But is Stoner a dick… ? That’s a shallow, short-sighted assessment. He’s a racer who is just there to race – as he freely admits he hates all the public relations BS – he’s not there for the fans and to play up to them, do fancy-dress pantomimes, grab cameras and wave and smile at them, and be a rock star. I do 46 yawns whenever I see that shite.

    Just as you’ll “take the guy who can win and still be appreciative of the people who support him” I’ll take the guy who rides fastest – and fairest. Who’ll pull insane but fair overtaking manoevers on the World Champ (Laguna Seca, sorry J-Lo) who’ll pick a perfect line and drive out of the last corner (sorry Ben) and I could care less if I’m ‘appreciated’ as a fan. Right now, and for the forseeable future, both the fastest and fairest is Stoner and Honda. Given equal machinery, I still believe Rossi would not beat Stoner…. but sadly, we’ll never see that.

    I don’t believe Rossi will get another win in MotoGP as long as he stays at Ducati – and that’s a great pity for MotoGP.

  13. Will says:

    Motogp currently sux!!! It’s a yawn fest. Bring back ’04 & ’05… The electronics have ruined it. Moaner maybe fast on a good bike, but he’s boring as sh!t. Id rather watch footage of rossi and gibernau dicing it up. Moaner is just a new wayne gardner… Gimme a break. Troy Bayliss is the best aussie rider IMO (and a guy named Mick)and a hell of a nice guy, too bad he didnt get a fair shake.

  14. Lumengrid says:

    Is Honda still bearing grudge for Rossi?

    Anyway not being a Rossi fan I think he is right in his reply to this HRC revelation :)

    Rossi is so much more fun to watch and altough he is great actor and does lot to please the public he is doing it in such manner that he will always get away with.
    Look at Rossi fans from all over the world and tell me if Casey has even a quarter of popularity?
    And its all good that he race for himself but at the end of the day Companies like Honda or any other connected with motorcycle industries look at sales figures and the way to boost them. And when signing rider they will look at popularity not only the results that driver brings to them.

  15. Dave Bardell says:

    Seems like Stoner and Pedrosa make perfect team mates – They are two of a kind. It’s up to you to decide what that “kind” is!!

  16. Adam says:

    “look at what we have now” Stats are stats and can be quoted in which ever way you like. so here is my take, VR will be turning 33 next week while CS will be 27 this year. Rossi 9 total world championships, CS 2 he will have to win every year for the next 5 years to match VR’s championships run in MotoGP by the same age, not impossible – hope he can do it :)(2008/2009 were against the same top riders) 16 year GP career VR finished out of the top 3 twice – his first year and last year…. Talent comes and goes and since last year CS is on top like VR was before his broken leg, who knows the one to topple CS could be ridding in Moto3 or 2 right now or JL will take it to him this year. perhaps VR should have just stayed with Yamaha instead of making this move so late in his career, if Ducati can challenge for podiums this year look for him to sign 2 more years and retire in 2014. If not he will retire this year, he already hinted at it in his Vrooom press conference. Best of luck to all the riders this year it going to be tough to beat the best in CS!

  17. Westward says:

    If Rossi doesn’t injure his shoulder after Qatar in 2010, Rossi would have more than 26 wins, more than 59 podiums, and possibly one more championship…

    It would even bet he doesn’t hurt his leg at Mugello…

    In 2011, if Rossi were on any other bike but a Ducati, he would have more wins and podiums too. Lorenzo and Stoner are the beneficiaries of circumstance…

    A healthy Rossi on a competitive bike, not necessarily a better bike, is still the man to beat in MotoGP…

  18. Smitch says:

    Those of you saying “its valid since 2006″ are drinking the HRC kool-aid. “It’s only fair because that’s when Stacey Moaner entered MotoGP.” That’s BS. Compare them man to man, career for career.

    This is a perfect example of the same dubious practices that gave us “creative accounting”.

  19. FPak says:

    Fair enough HRC. Now lets do a different statistical analysis where we compare the first 5 years of Rossi’s GP career to the first 5 years of Stoner’s. Whats that you say? Stoner got rapped? Thought so :)

    Anyone can skew numbers to make them palatable to their cause. Just look at Wallstreet.

  20. Westward says:

    BTW, Stoner is probably better than Bayless, and maybe even Doohan. As for Stoner being a dick, thats his prerogative. Great racer, just a bad entertainer. Unfortunately, he doesn’t realise his sport is meant to be entertainment as well. That is why Rossi makes so much more than his paycheck from racing…

    Rossi is so beneficial to the sport, his personality draws in spectators that could otherwise care less about the technology, but enjoy the spectacle of racing. He also attracts more sponsorship, and raises the consciousness of the sport to a wider audience.

    Stoner and Pedrosa are great for competition, they add credibility to the title. But Rossi, even Lorenzo, and to some extent Spies, do that and more for the sport as a whole, they make it bearable.

    I on the other hand do think on equal machinery, Rossi beats Stoner, as long as it is not an 800cc Ducati… The best thing to happen to Stoner last season, was Rossi going to Ducati.

    As for fast and fair, 2008 Laguna, was simply the underdog Rossi making the best of an unfortunate situation on the corkscrew. Stoner whining about it simply shows his personality and mental toughness… Lorenzo was the same way at Motegi in 2010.

  21. Peter Adamkovics says:

    rossi from 2001 to 2006:

    98 starts, 55 wins, 81 podiums, 5 championships, 56% win rate and a 83% championship rate which would have been 100% had Rossi not choked in the final race of 06…

    (do not have no. of poles readily available, but i’m guessing 50-55)

    that’s a ways better than Stoner’s run. Stoner can cherry pick whatever stats he wants, and no one will argue that he has had a better run the last 6 years, but he has a ways to go before he surpasses Rossi’s career. (if he can even catch up). In my opinion, Rossi will win races this year, but it will be rare, and he will come in 3rd or 4th for the championship. I also think he has 3, maybe 4 more productive years (including this one), and depending on what bike he races on, he can win 1 or 2 more championships before he retires. Then we’ll see if he wins a few WRC races/championships.

  22. Peter Adamkovics says:

    I agree with Westward, given equal machinery (not including the 800cc Duc) then Rossi wins over Stoner, maybe not every time, but more often than not. If the race is held at Mugello, then it’s 9 of 10 times.

  23. Steve says:

    Westward says:
    February 8, 2012 at 11:24 AM
    If Rossi doesn’t injure his shoulder after Qatar in 2010, Rossi would have more than 26 wins, more than 59 podiums, and possibly one more championship…

    It would even bet he doesn’t hurt his leg at Mugello…

    In 2011, if Rossi were on any other bike but a Ducati, he would have more wins and podiums too. Lorenzo and Stoner are the beneficiaries of circumstance…

    A healthy Rossi on a competitive bike, not necessarily a better bike, is still the man to beat in MotoGP…

    IF Rossi had not made a MISTAKE and injured his shoulder after Qatar in 2010
    IF Rossi had not made a MISTAKE and broke his leg at Mugello
    IF If Rossi had not taken the $ and gone to Ducati.
    Yes he probably would have, but he hasn’t.

    All the rubbish about stats and who is the best will never stop. You could say Gary Hocking had a better strike rate at 50% 4 years 2 World Championships 38 races 19 wins 33 Podiums 17 fastest laps 3 times runner-up Won 2 TT wins.
    If he hadn’t retired because his mate got killed he could have won 10 championships
    IF IF IF !

  24. F1 says:

    It’s all history but Hondas tweet is about recent history and that’s what counts going forward unless you retire. Rossi is the GOAT (IMO) but it was HIS choice to leave Yamaha (stupidstupidstupid) and now he’s officially stuck on a bike that does not compliment his riding style,, and never will. The future will be barely better than last year for the great one,, dam shame because I think that he had another 2 or 3 years as even money for a win had he stayed with the tuning fork company. If he had this dying desire to ride the Duc, he should have made the switch 5 years ago when he could have learned how to tame the bull. Team Honda is not looking back and he’ll be lucky to battle Spies for 4th next year. Stoners closest competition will be Dani with the exception of the few tracks where superior all out grunt has the least amount effect on lap times giving Lorenzo a few wins.. just like last year,,, yawn

    ,, his choice !

  25. I agree with whomever posted to make it realistic you have to take Rossi’s first 5 years vs. Stoner’s first 5 years. I think for Rossi it’s not the money that drove him to Ducati. it was the treatment from Lorenzo’s side of the garage plus it would be a hell of a feather in his cap if he can tame the Ducati and make it a winner again. That would be the icing on an incredible career. And one I’m hoping for.

  26. JW says:

    In the big picture Rossi is better for the sport, his fans adore him and he returns the affection willingly.

    Stoner on the other hand is a smug punk.

  27. jld says:

    Why would anyone think that comparing Rossi’s first 5 years to Stoner’s first 5 years would show anything useful? Stoner spent most of his early years on a Ducati and had to ride against Rossi. Rossi spent his early years on dominant Hondas with the field at its weakest in the last 40 years. It would be astounding if a great rider like Rossi didn’t dominate like he did, he was streets ahead of his rivals.

    After Rossi on the Ducati last year I’m slowly starting to think that Stoner’s 2009/2010 seasons on the CF Duc may be two of the best seasons anyone has ever put together in MotoGP/500cc. No he didn’t get a title but I just don’t see how anyone could win 1 race let alone 7 on that POS. Some time in 2007/2008 the mantle of best active rider passed from Rossi to Stoner, move on and stop the wailing and gnashing of teeth.

  28. jld- I disagree on several points. First- of course this discussion is pointless, but what else you gonna do to while away the days until the 2012 season starts.
    2nd-Stoner had the Ducati ride when they easily had the most powerful motor in the field. If I remember correctly he had about 10 kms top speed over everyone else at Shanghai’s back straight (the longest straight on the MotoGP circuit). You don’t need a great handling bike when you can out power everyone else on the straights.
    3rd- I wouldn’t consider Siberneau, Biaggi, Checa, Hayden etc… back markers allowing Rossi just to roll over them back in Rossi’s early years. Then switching to Yamaha when they were nowhere and dominating the field as well.
    But this has been a fun discussion

  29. I love the points made about entertaining the fans. It really is a show and I have very, very fond memories of the Kenny and Randy show. Roberts specifically mentioned that any time he could both win and wheelie everywhere, that’s what he did because he knew the fans would love it. Mamola felt the same way. Both were/are great showmen. Rossi is a great showman, too. I will say that Stoner entertains me, though: He just does it with those ridiculous slides despite electronics that try hard to make those slides impossible. THAT’s entertainment, too. :)

  30. rattle says:

    @Westward
    “If Rossi doesn’t injure his shoulder after Qatar in 2010, Rossi would have more than 26 wins, more than 59 podiums, and possibly one more championship…

    It would even bet he doesn’t hurt his leg at Mugello…

    In 2011, if Rossi were on any other bike but a Ducati, he would have more wins and podiums too. Lorenzo and Stoner are the beneficiaries of circumstance…

    A healthy Rossi on a competitive bike, not necessarily a better bike, is still the man to beat in MotoGP…”

    All if’s and buts can be used for Casey stoner as well. if he did not suffer from lactose-intolerance he could also have won the 09 championship. if he was on a competitive bike in 2010, he could still have won a few more races.
    And in 08 laguna, rossi went past his limit and cut the corner. if you pause the footage it’s clearly visible that both of his tyres were outside and on the gravel at the same time at the corkscrew but race direction didn’t mind because, hey “it’s rossi”. not only that when re-entering the track he almost collided with stoner causing him to slow and change his line. the corkscrew move was huge act of desperation and a mistake but no one cared. stoner did a mistake as well and that was the end of his challenge for the win. Same with j-lo in motegi. collided with him to slow him down and get past. the only race rossi has won in recent years battling fair and square is catalunya 09.
    on a same bike whether rossi will be better is debatable. and you won’t get to see it either cos he doesn’t like having an alien as teammate. i think on any bike stoner will still be the fastest considering some of the lap times he did(1sec ahead of the rest in valencia 11 qualifying)

  31. SRAD Pitt says:

    jimbosidecar says:
    February 8, 2012 at 9:34 PM

    Stoner had the Ducati ride when they easily had the most powerful motor in the field. If I remember correctly he had about 10 kms top speed over everyone else at Shanghai’s back straight (the longest straight on the MotoGP circuit). You don’t need a great handling bike when you can out power everyone else on the straights.
    3rd- I wouldn’t consider Siberneau, Biaggi, Checa, Hayden etc… back markers allowing Rossi just to roll over them back in Rossi’s early years. Then switching to Yamaha when they were nowhere and dominating the field as well.
    But this has been a fun discussion

    It started as the most powerful bike, but by about the 4th round there was very little speed difference as Honda and Yam had turned up their fuel consumption.
    There’s also a lot of corners on tracks, the outright power of a bike isn’t as noticeable as it is on the street – why do you think WSS bikes are limited to using road tyres? They’d post times to challenge the WSB bikes otherwise.
    The competition in Rossi’s early career was nowhere near the level it is now and Rossi had the best bikes / tyres. Melandri was runner up one year there, the ‘aliens’ are on a whole other level compared to him. He used to be able to toy with his competition, no way he can afford to do that since 07

    Anyways, best of luck to them all. We should feel lucky we have this level of competition.

    PS – if anyone’s going to call Stoner ‘Moaner’ I reserve the right to call Vale ‘Failentino’ as last year was abysmal.

  32. jld says:

    jimbosidecar – the 07 Ducati had a speed advantage on the Japanese bikes until they got their fuel maps sorted(four races? five?) but it was always a pig to turn. Straight line speed means nothing if you can’t get close enough to use it. You may want to rewatch Catalunya 2007 to see how the relative strengths change as the season progressed.

    And Gibernau, Biaggi, Hayden and Checa may not be back markers but in any other era they are grid filler who can get occasional wins, something like Vermuelen or Hopper from recent years. 27 wins between then over 41 seasons – Lorenzo and Pedrosa have 32 wins between them in just 10 seasons. Biaggi has by far the best resume of the riders you list but he is basically a lightweight version of Pedrosa (13 wins vs 15 with a history of 2nd/3rd place in the title chase). Its pretty clear to everyone now that Pedrosa is the backmarker of the four ‘aliens’ but he is still better performed than your best rider from the pre-2006 crop. If for some reason Stoner and Lorenzo never rode and Rossi’s main rival in the 800 era was Pedrosa can you imagine what his win totals and title count would look like now?

  33. All the talk about who’s better gets lost in the wake of the bikes/eras not being equivalent. Even the talk of Stoner versus Rossi on the Ducati doesn’t quite cut it. It’s all stats and fanboi-ism and gnashing of teeth. :) I say put ‘em all on H2 750s wearing Pirelli Phantoms and may the best man win. :p

  34. mxs says:

    LOL …. I love seeing the Rossi’s following getting their panties in bunch, every time someone reminds them that there’s another skilled rider who managed to beat him not only on Honda, but also on a bike he could not put on a podium for a one whole year (with 15 frame modifications …).

    Priceless ….

  35. mxs says:

    LOL2 … Jensen you get it right? Anytime you need to spike traffic on your site, just post one of the Rossi vs. Stoner topics and you have a guaranteed success.

    I love the post of the guy who has 25 “if” words in his post …. You know “if there was a snow storm in Qatar” Rossi would have won.