MotoGP: Race Results from the Aragon GP

09/29/2013 @ 11:27 am, by Jensen Beeler69 COMMENTS


MotoGP Race Results from the Aragon GP at Motorland Aragon, Spain:

Pos. Rider Team Bike KM/H Diff.
1 Marc MARQUEZ Repsol Honda Team Honda 166.6 42’03.459
2 Jorge LORENZO Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 166.5 +1.356
3 Valentino ROSSI Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 165.7 +12.927
4 Alvaro BAUTISTA GO&FUN Honda Gresini Honda 165.7 +13.787
5 Stefan BRADL LCR Honda MotoGP Honda 165.7 +13.973
6 Cal CRUTCHLOW Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 165.6 +14.662
7 Bradley SMITH Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 164.5 +31.220
8 Andrea DOVIZIOSO Ducati Team Ducati 163.9 +40.671
9 Nicky HAYDEN Ducati Team Ducati 163.1 +53.413
10 Andrea IANNONE Energy T.I. Pramac Racing Ducati 163.0 +55.067
11 Aleix ESPARGARO Power Electronics Aspar ART 162.8 +58.001
12 Yonny HERNANDEZ Ignite Pramac Racing Ducati 162.4 +1’05.513
13 Randy DE PUNIET Power Electronics Aspar ART 162.3 +1’06.589
14 Hiroshi AOYAMA Avintia Blusens FTR 162.2 +1’08.674
15 Claudio CORTI NGM Mobile Forward Racing FTR Kawasaki 162.1 +1’09.130
16 Colin EDWARDS NGM Mobile Forward Racing FTR Kawasaki 161.9 +1’12.041
17 Luca SCASSA Cardion AB Motoracing ART 159.9 +1’45.152
18 Bryan STARING GO&FUN Honda Gresini FTR Honda 159.9 +1’45.228
19 Lukas PESEK Came IodaRacing Project Ioda-Suter 159.9 +1’45.583
Not Classified
Hector BARBERA Avintia Blusens FTR 157.8 15 Laps
Dani PEDROSA Repsol Honda Team Honda 166.7 18 Laps
Damian CUDLIN Paul Bird Motorsport PBM 152.2 20 Laps
Danilo PETRUCCI Came IodaRacing Project Ioda-Suter 0 Lap
Michael LAVERTY Paul Bird Motorsport ART 0 Lap

Source: MotoGP; Photo: HRC

  • “That Guy”

    I never would have thought MM would be Champion in his rookie season.

    I believe it now.

    Fantastic achievement…well…possibly soon anyway.

    Looks like we will have several years of watching MM win Championships now.

    He is going to get better. Nobody can keep up with him now.

  • ross ewich

    its going to fun, hearing what leaks out from the Pedrosa camp about MM taking him out.

  • TexusTim

    Well I have to say I am disapointed that Marquez had to do what he did to win and keep Pedrosa form coming back to him this season, I hope dorna takes the points from this round from him..then then if he takes out another rider in that fashion he will should be forced sit out for the season so he will learn to pass like a pro. look at all the other passes under speed, besides that he was “dogging” not pushing him but trying to take him out under the radar..I hope they do somthig to teach him a lesson, no
    Wonder why lorenzo let him by better to finish than tt get taken out and maybe injured.
    David I have to say “sorry” you were right to say he might be riding unsafely.

  • gabe

    It looks like a racing incident to me. Pedrosa seemed to have difficulty on corner entry and scrubbed too much speed. MM did what he could to avoid him, not the first time this season. Marquez is at the height of his powers and will race harder than anybody else.

    The same way brake levers are protected from contact, so should the sensors.

  • L2C

    One of the contributing factors to what happened today between Marquez and Pedrosa is the fact that Marquez gets away with nearly everything. He has always been the exception to the rules. One can’t even count on one hand the number of ‘incidents’ that he has been involved in this season, forget trying to remember the details of his exceptionally long rap sheet covering the course of his career. He always benefits from his infractions – penalized or not.

    For this one today, he should be banned from performing in the next race. He should be banned if only to send a message. He won’t hear it, but he should be sent the message anyway.

    Marquez is going to kill somebody one day. Someone or himself.

    And I don’t want to hear anything about how today’s ‘incident’ was unintentional. Marquez’s racing style is intentional regardless of the unintended consequences of going about his business the way he does. If one draws up a list of the ‘incidents’ that he has been involved in -just for this season alone- one would have to conclude that he is incapable of reigning himself in. The kid is borderline crazy on the track and at times he does cross the line. Expect him continue in this fashion in the future. Ban or no ban, he will never change his ways because it is clear that he has no control over who he is.


    Holding back personal feelings here.

  • Gabe

    There is no protection to the sensor:

    Incidents happen. Even on normal trackdays, going at intermediate pace, elbows do touch, people change line in front of you, shit does happen.

    Riders don’t kill people. Racing kills people. It is very sad when it happens, but if watching a rider is too emotional, I suggest a different sport?

  • L2C

    It’s in Marc’s ability to be a more conscientious rider. Just as it has been for Alvaro, just as it has been for Dani. He is not an exception to this. If he doesn’t change his style to suit certain situations, he will be the cause of someone’s crippling injuries or death. “Racing” doesn’t have anything to do with it. That’s just a label.

    Things like what happened today always happen around Márquez.

    Like someone else said earlier, Dani changed his game after taking out Nicky Hayden in 2006. Will Marc do the same given how much favoritism he’s been shown throughout his career? Don’t count on it. Could happen, but don’t hold your breath.

    And as for art, it has a tendency to evoke emotion. Otherwise, I have no idea what you’re talking about.

  • Pemberton

    lol at you panzies calling for marquez to be banned. he did absolutely nothing wrong, he was merely doing something called RACING, something these other boys at the top have forgotten how to do.

  • Bruce

    +1 Gabe. It was simply close racing.

  • Gabe

    There have been riders who all rode hard and outside of a “conscientious” manner:

    Schwantz v Rainey in the 90s. Edwards v. Bayliss. Entire generations of 250cc riders (Capirossi, Melandri, Lorenzo, and Simoncelli.) Rossi is notorious for hard racing. I don’t remember any outcry recently when Hayden pushed Dovi. Should we stop being fans of the sport ? How about Biaggi?

    As for saying Marquez will cause someone else to die, that’s a bit harsh. Who are we blaming for Peter Lenz? Tomizawa? Simoncelli? Was it unconscionable riding that killed them?

    You know what else happens around Marquez? Winning.

  • michaelnewmex

    It will be interesting to hear Pedrosa’s take on the incident. My take (FWIW) is that after the contact from Marquez, Pedrosa responded by getting on the throttle perhaps a little too soon, a little too aggressively…resulting in the high side.

  • Gabe

    Pedrosa is livid, it’s the impression I get from reading the websites from Spain. Even before, I recall that Pedrosa refuses to acknowledge Marquez on the podium, or to clink bottles. I imagine a very unhappy situation inside HRC right now.

    Given the machinations of Pedrosa and his manager vs. Hayden in 2006 and 2007, I don’t feel so bad for him.

    Maybe they can borrow Yamaha’s paddock wall from 2009.

    MM is decidedly on a different level.

  • Law

    michaelnewmex says:
    ””’It will be interesting to hear Pedrosa’s take on the incident. My take (FWIW) is that after the contact from Marquez, Pedrosa responded by getting on the throttle perhaps a little too soon, a little too aggressively…resulting in the high side.””

    That is correct but only because the finesse is gone.
    The result of the new fly by wire systems that allows a more ham fisted riding/braking style.
    Once that system was unknowingly broken the ham fist style bites the rider for his rough usage of the throttle

    I am not saying these riders who are the best in the world dont have finesse or had it.
    I am saying as more & more aids are added the need for finesse & the skills that come with it goes away. It has all become more of a switch on/off control system.

    If an aid should suddenly fail a rider will not suddenly know it & revert to a different style.
    Instead you see what we saw with Dani

  • L2C

    Either one is aware of his surroundings or one isn’t. Márquez is blind as a bat on the track. His excuse is always that he didn’t see something, or that he didn’t realize something until it was too late. It is always the same with him. Today, it was he didn’t realize he was too close to Pedrosa until after he made contact. Always the same – other riders pay, he doesn’t.


    Pemberton. Internet tough guy. Probably the only place he/she can get away with calling someone he/she has never met a pansy.

  • JW

    I have been watching MOTOGP now for 10 years. I have seen a lot of contact from various riders (it serves no useful purpose to drop names) and seldom did the officials impose any penalties. Today, not cool. HRC ain’t gonna like it either. I really don’t think MM was too worried about DP before the race. I don’t think MM did this on purpose but I do think his “racing limits” will get him or someone else in permanent trouble some day. Watching Dani hit the Tarmac and slide on his knees ruined the spirit of this race for me personally and I’m not a DP fan. I don’t like seeing any rider take an nessasary hit like this, especially a teammate. Although his championship points bumped up today, MM might consider that his specialness meter just dropped down by several points.

    No matter who you like, today’s race left you feeling bad, kinda like when you know an election was rigged, so how does this help the sport Mr. DORNA?

  • Pemberton

    L2C, just calling it as i see it buddy, you are over reacting bigtime and grasping at straws at someone who is doing what he is there to do, RACE and WIN.

    Marquez is in his rookie season and sure will make mistakes, but he has not made a single mistake during the race that has endangered other riders in a malicious or incompetent way. he has merely made his presence felt. Anyone who would say otherwise obviously hasn’t watched the sport over any great period. You don’t win races by putting the other guys on a pedastool and hanging back thinking ‘wow, he is amazing!’, you go out and bloody race. Pedrosa & Lorenzo haven’t had to do that as often or as hard for a while.

    Pedrosa can be upset all he likes, it’s a rough outcome but this was clearly a freak incident. the chances of such a thing happening are obviously so low there was no forethought put into even protecting the system, which I’m sure they’ll have already addressed.

  • L2C

    Whatever, dude, you’re just as blind as Marc is. Calling it as you see it don’t mean shit. Marc colliding and making contact with other riders on a regular basis does.

    How about sticking with the facts. When Márquez hits other riders, bad things tend to happen. That’s the history, that’s the reality. Forget your condescending manner for a moment and consider how many times Marc has been the cause of bad shit happening. He is unrivaled on this. Yeah, he’s also the champion of bad shit. SEE THAT!

  • “For this one today, he should be banned from performing in the next race. He should be banned if only to send a message.”

    Having seen the reply about a dozen times, the point here is that it was the most gentle of love-taps. You’re blaming MM because Honda leaves their TC sensors unprotected?

    The word “scapegoat” comes to mind. This was 100% racing incident + maybe less than optimal design. Nobody should get banned for Dani high-siding. I’m disappointed that he probably lost his last ever title chance by getting tossed off the bike. I’m not looking to lynch anybody over it.

  • “Having seen the reply” should be “Having seen the replay”. *sigh*

  • gabe

    Let’s keep our sense of proportion about and let’s stop foaming at the mouth: Race direction might hand down a penalty after all.

    Funny things happen to some rider’s bikes. Do you guys remember when Pedrosa’s throttle got stuck open? or last year, when the brake jammed? By all accounts, he should have won the championship last year. I am not saying he’s Ben Spies, but Pedrosa has some bad luck also.

  • TexusTim

    gabe I like you but there isnt a defense to the way marquez rode in this race..he was doing more than trying to push danny he was trying for close contact to knock him off his game I am surpised to see you defend him when reviewng the race there were many close pasess and riders right behind another one and only marquez forced contct and made a rider crash I know what I saw and this was intentional and it’s my opinion before this is all said and done dorna will either take points or do somthing to reing him in cuz I agree lc2 if he doesnt get in trouble for this it will continue and he will serously hurt someone or himsel. i WILL NO LONGER ROOT for marquez to win I saw somthing in this race that tells me he has no class at all..all this talk before the race about how pedrosa has to win and he doesnt..did it looki like that on the track ? or a rider willing to force another into a huge highside.if danny would have smacked his shoulder he might have been knocked out for the season and maybe his career.
    I know this may sound heavy handed but he should not be allowed to continue like this just because he’s the new “dorna young gun” if he hurts a popular rider this will all change…you didnt see him ride like that agains rossi when they had there battle did you ?

  • “I am not saying he’s Ben Spies, but Pedrosa has some bad luck also.”

    He sure has had an incredible history of injuries over the span of his career in the world championship.

  • Mike

    Yeah “this” incident was not that big but………….

    I think what folks are getting pissed about/Tired of is…… Marc has some bad habits.

    His taps may be hard or soft depending on whats happening but this is not MX & the other riders
    Marc is passing are not berms to be used to bounce off when he yet again rides over his head into a turn.

    It is cool & he is young & he WILL learn.
    But hopefully it is at his own expense & not the expense of some other riders or even Marshals like the other week when his bike went sailing past some marshals heads as They helped Cal under Yellow flags & Marc kept flying.

    Not so unlike this one where he cleaned out Wilarot & injured him good

  • meatspin

    its quite amazing that the sensor cable looks so cleanly snapped. That is a jedi level feat. Imagine, moving at that speed, and then turning and braking in the bike to the corner, and just having your clutch lever or elbow knock it just “so” as to snap it cleanly and then darting out the way as DPs bike loops out of control. It must be harder than bullseyeing womp rats.

    Anyway. this incident is so so unlucky for Pedrosa. AGAIN. I’m definitely sure Honda will be putting a CF shroud over it from now on. Unbelievable bad luck for that guy.

  • “I know what I saw and this was intentional”

    That’s just crazy talk, Tim. His intention was obviously to avoid contact and the love tap just happened to snip a sensor wire against all probability.

    “you didnt see him ride like that agains rossi when they had there battle did you ?”

    Of course, we did. Rossi and Marquez have traded hard passes over several races. Let’s not get selective memory here.

  • TexusTim

    @ pemberton i am not a friggin you race sir ? have you ever even ridden a bike on the track ?
    have you ever been taken out by someone when leading a race ?..when there a lap down and just trying to upset another rider who is going to win ?..if not you have no room to call me or anyone else a panzie

  • damn

    Marq was already to close to dani and i thought he hit danis tyres befor the crash. Mm keeps riding so close he touches people without thinking about anything. Jorge casey dani can race close without hitting and injure the other riders. Marq put it were he wants and call it a little touch. Because of marq dani fight for the title is over. Just like with jorge in the beginning of the season. I say yes taking away 25 points to make a statement. Becausd more people are riding for the title. If i was dani i would do a senna on marq.

  • Minibull

    Bloody hell, I’m a huge Pedrosa fan and was gutted watching the race today, but you can’t say that was deliberate and that Marquez should be banned for a race. He was riding extremely close at times, but then I never remember there being any rules against that.
    Punishment is proper insane to me, deliberate would be kicking your foot out and breaking the cable, or doing an overtake up the inside which there is clearly no room for, knocking or pushing another rider wide.
    I do however find Marquez’s riding to be pretty insane at times, and one day it will bite him on the bum. He will seriously injure (another) rider, or himself. Pedrosa’s pass on him was real nice, perfect line, close and a real good block. The passes between Bautista and Bradl at the end were great too, that is how it should be done IMO.

    Marquez has had a lucky season so far, with the huge amount of crashes he has had yet he doesn’t get injured, and incidents with other riders. This one at Aragon yesterday, the one against Lorenzo at the start of the year, and at Silverstone with Crutchlow and the marshalls.
    Contrast that to bad luck on Pedrosa’s side that always dogs him, like when Lorenzo was out at the Sachsenring, he has a real freak accident himself that takes him out, not able to get any advantage. And then now you have this. Last year you had the tyre warmer/Barbera incident…the list goes on…much like Spies.

  • Will

    Hey Tim, does your keyboard not have a period or comma key? Rambling sentences…make your comments really hard to read.

    I’m wondering if I watched the same race you guys did. Because I sure as hell didn’t see anything intentional. I must have re-watched pedrosa crash 10 times.

    Marquez is the future of Motogp, and Puig knows it. Watching him put his head down in the HRC pitwall booth after Perosa went down was priceless.

  • BBQdog

    @L2C: fully agree, Marquez has nearly not been penalized in the past and had done many stupid and dangerous actions. So far he has not killed himself or any other. But sooner or later he will run out of luck. Remember the 300+ kmh drop parallel to the wall in Italy ? If he is partly blind or mentally not 100% we will hear after he resigns. But it is clear the spanish organisation in the ‘Spanish Open’ will keep a hand above his head.

  • Alex

    Marquez has been extremely lucky this season… that he hasn’t killed himself. With the crash he had at Mugello and others, incidents with Lorenzo & Pedrosa … he has shown himself to be a little out of control out on the track.

    I like Marquez. He has a great personality and amazing talent but, unless he learns some riding discipline and maturity… I see a Simoncelli-kind of ending for him.

    The boyish smile and shrug of the shoulders doesn’t fly with me when you take out your teammate because you went into the corner too hot…. especially when he his your chief rival for the championship.
    I don’t think it was intentional … but it was still reckless riding.

  • Pemberton

    TexasTim: yes, I have many years track racing, I’ve also been taken out it’s a bitter bitter thing, you too? but woopity-doo-dah. track riding or racing at amateur or even semi-pro levels has no correlation on MotoGP.

    Your opinion, like mine is meaningless in any real terms but fortunately I have chosen the correct opinion because I guarantee you if you survey any other riders in the MotoGP paddock they will not carry on about Marquez like you wallys are doing.

    Marquez has only hit another rider once this season, Lorenzo and again guess what? Marquez was RACING! and Lorenzo took a wide line and invited the kid in and paid for it.

    The tap in this instance was a first and it was extremely light, if it was not for a freak incident happening pedrosa would have accelerated away fine as Marquez rolled well wide losing seconds. Sometimes thats just the way the dice rolls, it’s called RACING.

  • Jimbo

    Well well well. I have to say for those boring sods who go on and on about F1 they dont get forums as passionate as this! This is why I love MotoGP. A couple of Points:

    1)Dani is probably the most unlucky guy in MotoGP ever. He is the Bridesmaid of racing. Last year the bowling ball took him out this year it is Marquez.
    2) When Dorner enforced the brake guards on the handlebars to prevent accidents did no one think exposed cables would probably cause problems too!!! That is a very, very dangerous design flaw.
    3) Was MM riding too agressive? Possibly. Did he mean to do it? Certainly not – watch the footage he touches and corrects his line and goes off track he does not continue to force his way through in the way him and lorenzo did in the last few laps of Silverstone. I would argue he is learning. Remember that if that cable hadnt snapped Pedrosa would have been fine.
    4) The touch they had was light enough that it did not cause a big devation for Pedrosa on his racing line. we have seen many more contacts this season where the bikes have moved more after the fact but because a wire wasnt broken there is no issue.
    5) Pedrosa is going to react more angrilly because it is MM. He has been very shown up by him this season and from his perspective will be the icing on the cake. As someone who likes pedrosa i would advise him to be cautious how far he takes this. Wether its right or wrong i think we all know who honda would stick by in an either/or situation.

  • Pemberton

    Also, every crash Marquez has had it is evident he has a freakish ability to control things even when they go bad.

    Crashes happen at this level, stop crying like babies. It’s happened more frequently and to every rider this year due to some of the tyre issues. There is a skill even in the way these guys crash and Marquez is learning an insane amount of input and variables compared to the other guys and arguably pushing these machines harder than anyone else.

    Analyze all the crashes he’s had this season and just like his riding, there is a freakish level of skill he’s putting in right up to the very last nanosecond where he crashes. You are an absolute fool if you think he has walked away fine from some of the huge rashes he’s had because of luck……

    Admittedly, the technology levels these days has no doubt helped and a big high-side would shake him, but such is the game we’re in.

  • Pemberton

    Well said Jimbo.

    Let’s be realistic, Pedrosa would have come third. Sans cable incident, all Pedrosa would have done is served to delay Marquez hunting down Lorenzo.

    Pedrosa has been outclassed from the start and he knows it, it shows constantly in his demeanor, he is not even in the game because he is completely psyched out. Pedrosa is great, but he has never had the ability to pull that extra 1% out of nowhere.

  • Pemberton

    Pedrosa won’t be at honda beyond 2014. Kidding yourself to think otherwise.

  • Jimbo


    Completley agree – he will be out by end of next season. I think the best place for him would be look to Suzuki when they arrive. Pedrosa is an amazing rider and a “new team” would be very lucky to help with development. But I think last season was his chance to be a champion and it just never happened.

  • Jimbo

    Also sorry all just to comment away from the whole MM/DP mash up situation –

    I have to say the last lap tussle between Bradl and Bautista was just fanctasitc to watch! i think i saw 4 passes in two corners! thats the type of racing i love to see and hats off to Bautista for managng not to crash into Bradl during it. I cant remember if they actually contacted at all but hopefully not.

    Back to the pedrosa thing – interms of race direction re-saftey they should look into the way the cables are protected, in the same way as they reviewed the brake guards on the handlebars. For what was a very gentle touch there was a huge highside because of an electronic gizmo.
    Reinforces how important TC is. When it goes wrong its nearly always high side. I wince when i think of Spies in indy practice

  • PD

    Pemberton, I am so awed by your “correct opinion,” I am going to place you on a “pedastool.” Yes, racers shouldn’t put others on pedastools, but you, for damn sure, deserve to be put on a pedastool. Pedastools should be reserved for those with such correct opinions, and since you are so blessed with such correct opinions, you damn well should be put on a pedastool. In fact, you should be placed on two – no, three pedastools. Pedastools are where you should be put.

    Yes, racers are superhuman warriors, and, as such, any action they take, no matter how aggressively perceived, should be free from sanction, penalties, bans, etc., for that matter even from any criticism such as we are seeing from these flaming pansies on this site. Yes, how dare these pansies criticize manly racers doing manly things. Certainly, none of these pansies deserve to be on pedastools, do they? Nuh Uh. No pedastools for these pansies. Not even one pedastool. In fact, it’s not only just these pansies that do not deserve to be put on pedastools, but also “racers” who refuse to take others out. How dare they even call themselves racers. No, if you “race” with the pansy attitude that there are others on the track besides yourself, you do not deserve to be called a racer. You certainly do not deserve to be put on a pedastool.

  • JS

    Look at all the Rossi muppets calling for Marquez to be punished/banned. Truely pathetic and I don’t recall these cries of foul play when it was Rossi sending a rider into the gravel.

    Marquez has reminded the MotoGP grid that there’s this thing called racing and that MotoGP isn’t a time trial sport. Lorenzo has responded and stepped up to the plate to take on Marquez, it’s time for the other riders to do the same.

    As for Pedrosa, he’ll remain at HRC for the foreseeable future as he makes an excellent number 2 in the team and there’s no one better to take his place yet. What’s incredible about Pedrosa though is that his fans still think he will one day be MotoGP champion – no he wont – never ever.

  • damn

    @js@ YOUR right about dani. He wil never win the title. This should have been his year. And dani was so glad mm took his settings to ride a better race in multiple races. Sometimes mmm had it rough but with danis settings he performed pretty good. Seems to me hrc dont back dani and does all for for mm. With taking danis settings and taking him out of the title run danis team must be realy happy. Jorge rides harder but still not like mm does. Jorge still has brains.

  • Adrian

    The comment about MM dominating Pedrosa this season is a stretch. He only really started winning when Jorge and Dani got injured. Not that his performances haven’t been impressive this year, but if all were healthy I still think he’s 3rd best. As for yesterday, I think the accident robbed us of a good finish. MM and Dani were really close in pace and I’m most disappointed in not getting a better finish.

    On another note, one more reason why there should be less sensors and electronics in MotoGP.

  • Gabe

    Marc has got injured in the past:

    Twice now he’s hit his head and ended up with double vision. The last time it lasted months and there was talk of ending his career. And as for Wilairot, the scooter accident that he had while back in Thailand has a lot more to do with the end of his career than getting punted by Marquez.

    Not sure why people are saying that he is intentionally trying to take people out. Let’s not try to project our motivations onto him. Just because someone might do that on some club racing bush league, it doesn’t mean that’s what’s going on in international racing.

    I am not sure what kind of racing you guys want to see, but less electronics will equal less power.

    If you’re the type of person that you need someone to root for, then perhaps racing isn’t the sport for you to follow.

  • L2C

    @Trane Francks

    “Not looking to lynch anybody over it…”? When has lynching anybody ever been okay?

    The point is not the sensor design, how it was mounted, was flawed – the point is that there would have been no broken sensor wire or high side at that point in the race if Marc had not made contact. The responsibility for the flawed design fully rests with HRC, (but I do recognize that MotoGP bikes are prototypes, so things are not going to be built to consumer spec), Marc being the catalyst for yet another catastrophe is the point I have made and he is fully responsible for it.

    You don’t see judges siding with motorists who side swipe other motorists, however lightly. Reckless endangerment is what it is. No difference on a race track.

    One of the reasons that Race Direction exists is to hold riders accountable for the consequences of their actions, whether their actions were intended or not. Of course, accidents happen in racing. This still doesn’t absolve a rider of his obligation to be mindful of the safety of other riders on the track.

    Marc may be a test pilot, but it doesn’t mean that he gets walk away clean for clipping the wings of another pilot. Most likely Pedrosa would be dead today had both he and Marc been fighter pilots. Had they both been fighter pilots, Marc would have been held accountable regardless of whether Pedrosa would have survived the collision.

    Marc is more accident prone than Jon Hopkins. That’s saying plenty. The difference is that Jon suffers the consequences personally. Whereas with regards to Marc’s disasters, other riders are far more likely to bear the heavy costs than Marc is. Marc tends to benefit when things go wrong and others pay. Period.

  • L2C

    @ PD


  • Gabe


    “Most likely Pedrosa would be dead today had both he and Marc been fighter pilots”

    Is that your frame of reference?

    Get a grip on reality, man. One has nothing to do with the other, maybe except that both get told how special they are.

    But if they were…who’s Iceman? Who’s Maverick? Slider? Hollywood? Viper?

  • neil

    I agree with Will, watching Puig after Dani crashed was priceless….feel for Dani though, it was his Birthday.
    Anything can happen, but I think MM will be the champ this year.

  • SBPilot

    @ L2C – you need a reality check.

    There is no way MM would have intentionally clipped that little wire. Did you see the pictures? It’s impossible to intentionally aim for that 2″ of wire. Yes MM was a catalyst but the “contact” was so minuscule you had to watch the reply 50 times just to see if there even was any contact. MM did what he had to do to avoid Dani and frankly he did avoid him.

    DP has had bad luck his whole career at Honda. Should that cable have been protected? well if it that little cable can dictate the rider between highsiding to the moon and riding on the limit safety, then yes, it should be protected. If that sensor is to fail, should there be a fail safe system in the software? Again, if it prevents the rider from highsiding to the moon, then perhaps there should be a failsafe.

    People need to realize that if these bikes were not so electronically controlled (ala full throttle while at full lean and letting electronics handle the power delivery) Pedrosa would not have been affected by this “contact” what so ever. Not to mention half the technical problems riders have are due to faulty sensors. There have been major crashes due to electrical issues. Just look at Spies most recent possible career ending highside. He was in bloody first gear, NO contact, and putting around and due to his TC not kicking in, he highsided to the moon and screwed his other shoulder.

    You could easily point at the flaws of this electronic era of racing by this MM/DP incident. This would merely have been close racing without that sensor. Racing doesn’t get any closer and exciting than this, and this is what we like to see. If the bikes didn’t have a million sensors, there would be no problem. The reality is that there are these sensors, that does NOT mean racing shouldn’t be close anymore. Riders shouldn’t have to race with the fear in the back of their head telling them not to get too close to their competitors because they might clip a 2″ sensor wire, that is ludicrous.

    It’s so easy to point the finger at a person, that’s human nature. Pedrosa will do it (understandably) and so will a bunch of MM haters.

  • L2C

    @ SBPilot

    You and a few other readers seem to think that I said Marc’s incident was intentional. I didn’t say it was, nor did I imply.

    Read first. Criticize later. At this point, your entire post means nothing based on the fact that you wrote it on a false premise.

  • L2C

    @ Gabe

    Why bother with saying some childish shit? Was Top Gun about fighter jet test pilots who flew prototypes? No. No it wasn’t. I drew an appropriate analogy.

    Stop the antics. Argue or don’t.

  • gabe


    I am withdrawing myself from the discussion. You and your permanently-hurt feelings can remain.

  • L2C

    And I’m not really sure the design of the sensor cable on the RC213V is flawed. Only the engineers at HRC can determine that. It’s worked well so far. And it will probably continue to work well should they decide not to do anything about it.

    But Marc’s aggressive style that includes consistently bumping into the back of other riders – yeah, there’s a flaw for you. A real one.

  • L2C

    Good, you haven’t said anything substantial anyway. Only shared your feelings. Hardly any facts at all.

  • gabe

    Yes, if we were fighter pilots, I’d turn in my wings right now!

  • L2C

    @ gabe

    HRC wouldn’t even consider you.

    Clearly in addition to not getting the fighter jet test pilot analogy, you also missed the reference to HRC/Honda logo and Red Bull’s “Gives you wings.” Wings are depicted on the RC213V’s livery, for sakes.

    Whatever, dude.

  • Bruce


    I respect your right to have your opinion. However, I disagree with it. I don’t see MM as particularly more crash prone or dangerous than other fast rookies. Lorenzo and Stoner both hosted their fair share of yard sales in their rookie years. And though you say that the point is not the sensor design, it really is. Because you have to admit (I think) that if not for the TC failing…which caused the high-side…you would not otherwise be upset with the minor contact. Now you may say you would, but I’m sorry, as others have stated, you can barely even tell there was contact in the replay and MM stood it up and ran wide as he should have. He didn’t keep leaning on DP. It wasn’t a dangerous stunt IMO, it was close, non-processional racing, which we as fans want. Accidents happen.

  • Gabe

    I take it all back. Mystery solved. It was all MMs fault. Here’s the proof

    I am still turning in my wings. Off to haul rubber dog shit out of Hong Kong.

  • L2C

    @ Bruce

    If a car traveling at highway speeds runs over a piece of slate in just the right way causing the rock to nick the fuel line causing a leak, would that mean the car manufacturer’s engineers were responsible for a design flaw? Out of countable millions of different kinds of accidents and unintended off-road excursions, this one freakish occurrence would warrant a new design to be implemented?

    Most likely it wouldn’t. In HRC’s case, they may think the same. But to ease fears and concerns for everybody but them, they may change the design.

    Like I said, I’m not sure about whether the design needs to be reconsidered.

  • Jimbo

    @L2C @Bruce I think the Honda engineers will change the sensor. Ducati have two, one on either side specifically as a safety measure. I think other teams will work to adopt

  • Frank

    It was very sad seeing Dani go down. It definitely affected the rest of the race and made the battle for the podium much less exciting. (The Bradl/Bautista exchange was one of the best battles of the year so far). I remember thinking that Dani was by far the fastest of the front three immediately before he passed Marquez. He had the harder option front and seemed to be able to close in on MM in the corner entry (more grip perhaps?) It looked (and I will watch this again) like he was braking later into the corners than Marc and glosing the gap before a great/clean pass. My first thought was- GREAT! Both riders had closed in on Lorenzo but Dani was quicker- now he will surely close in on Lorenzo within the next few corners and take the lead. But then… what happened? What I saw after that was Jorge opening/maintaining his gap and it looked like Pedrosa dropped his pace a bit. I will watch this again for sure- and maybe I’m off-base here but with the way he caught Marc and passed him I would have thought he would have pulled som gap to Marc and been keen to get on the hunt for Lorenzo. I didn’t see the killer instinct I was looking for. And granted it was not long after he passed Marc that the incident happened. Still- Marc out braked himself into the corner and stood the bike up after minimal contact and a freak wire-cutting. He stood up and went wide NOT taking Pedrosa out, which could have been the direct result of running into Dani’s line. Dani went down due to the TC failure. As one commentor posted: 100hp to the rear wheel thanks to TC up to 260 hp minus the TC = high side. Here are my thoughts (just thoughts):
    -After watching Marc as a marshal at COTA, he charges the corners HARD. It’s a physical feeling you get watching him. I was not a fan before I saw him live. I disliked what he did in Moto2 and pulled for Espargaro and Luthi a lot of the time. Seeing him in person made my jaw drop. He rides with an abandon that I haven’t seen since Rossi and Schwantz. Rossi loved Schwantz, Marquez loves Rossi. I became fascinated with him after seeing just what he could make a motoGP bike do.
    -I feel that Dani is deserving of a championship. Tire warmer stuck on the wheel last year and starting from the back of the grid cost him. That was just one example of bad luck last year. Lorenzo nearly bit it in that wet race before race control brought out the red flag with a charging Casey Stoner set to over take JL in the next lap.-another example.

    -This incident made me wonder… why was Marc so close when it seemed like Dani had much better pace. why wasnt he busy passing JL? I know Marc will fight you right back- everyone knows that. As much as you know whats coming if you pass Rossi. Dani knows this. With such a clinical pass, put the hammer down! Get away from Marc. You know he’s there, you know he’s coming, you know he brakes harder than anyone on the track. It’s how I feel in the first few corners with Bautista- get away from the dude-QUICK! (Granted, he has done much better this year). Marc took a deeper line on the brakes, over shot it, corrected (be it too late to make slight contact) and went wide as a result. The sensor thing is a 999 out of 1000- maybe WORSE odds to happen again. Before I saw the high-side my thought in those nanoseconds was- good, now Dani can focus on JL, and then I was heart-broken when he went down. Marquez was in his head and that is obvious. It’s been obvious as mentioned in some other posts in his demeanor ALL year. It was a defeated Dani after Sachsenring. To beat MM93 you have to have the same level of intensity, and whether you call that immature, reckless, dangerous or skilled racing with a willingness to do anything to put yourself in a place to win- that is the side that you choose to argue on. Either way the Dani that I’ve seen in post-race interviews and the Dani that didn’t pull away from Marquez once he passed him on Sunday is not going to beat him.

    -Livio also mentioned post-race that he thought Dani’s line was unusual. After just watching it again- he definitely lost ground to Lorenzo entering the turn, which is slow for him and for the Honda. Marc came in at the Honda’s pace in my opinion and Dani was there. That is where the Honda had the advantage and where Dani had closed the gap on Marc so quickly. Defensive riding by Dani maybe or was it just Marc over-shooting it? It’s a matter of opinion. Dani sure broke a lot more slowly on the corner entry than JL and Marc though. Just a thought. And actually after watching it yet again- Marc looked like he was approaching the turn on a better line- a little wider on the approach to shoot out of the corner.

    -Post race, Marc definitely seemed more tense than ever and even a bit defensive. He spoke more loudly than usual. He knew that what happened was BAD.

    I think it’s unlucky. A racing incident for sure. 2 times this year with the contact for Marc. It’s hard to forget his Moto2 blunders but still only 2 controversial ‘racing incidents’ this year.

    L2C – I appreciate your being a fan of Pedrosa. I’ve always appreciated his talent and hated his lack of luck. I’ve followed the site a while and I like it when you stand up for him against people calling for his ousting from the Repsol seat. My question to them is “who can beat him?” No one can answer that from the current field who is not already committed to one of the other top factory seats. Perhaps he will come back next season stronger and find some better fortune. His racing and his record is impressive to say the least and deserves respect.

  • Jumbo

    Best post on here. Nice to see a calm well set out discourse!

  • @L2C: “You don’t see judges siding with motorists who side swipe other motorists, however lightly. Reckless endangerment is what it is. No difference on a race track. ”

    Good grief, man. Try watching the video replay at a few dozen times. There was no reckless endangerment here. Mark was on his usual line and Dani wasn’t. Mark came in faster and because Dani was on a wonky, slower line. Mark had to pick it up to stop from taking him out. He succeeded. Had the wire been protected against contact as are other components on the bike, there wouldn’t be a discussion.

    @Mike: “Not so unlike this one where he cleaned out Wilarot & injured him good”

    COMPLETELY unlike that incident, in which his team told him to keep hot-shoeing it around the track even after the flag dropped. THAT was reckless and bad judgment on both MM’s and his team’s part. It could have been much, much worse. Steaming around at full tilt on a cool-down lap is just bogglingly wrong. MM got the penalty he deserved there, but the team should have been given a bigger on the knuckles.

  • L2C

    @ Trane Francks

    You don’t get it. It’s reckless endangerment whenever the actions of one causes an accident with another. Fact is, both riders were in an accident. The difference is that Marc rolled on his merry way while Pedrosa ate asphalt.

    Many keep saying that it was minor contact, light contact, hardly any contact at all. However, the result of that contact resulted in a broken TC cable on the Honda and a major high-side for Pedrosa.

    Spin it however you want, but Marc is at fault here. Clearly at fault. He deserves to be penalized because he is in fact responsible in part for what happened.

  • L2C

    @ Trane Francks

    And of course there wouldn’t be any discussion if Marc hadn’t broken the TC cable. This is obvious and not worth mentioning. Yet he did break the cable and that’s why this discussion exists.

  • @L2C: “You don’t get it. It’s reckless endangerment whenever the actions of one causes an accident with another.”

    Thanks, but I’m not living such a mentally plush life that I can’t understand the difference between a poorly designed TC sensor system (single exposed sensor that would be vulnerable to all manner of stuff, including a simple ride through the gravel trap) and overly aggressive riding.

    Tap, yes. Avoidable, yes. Shouldn’t have happened, maybe/probably. Worth a slap-down? Now in any series of racing I’ve ever seen, and I’ve been watching since the early ’70s.

    I’m reminded of the rear-ending Pintos going BOOM way back in the day. You could tap one in a few-mile-per-hour rear end and the thing would pop like a firecracker. The result was the same as this racing incident in a manner of speaking. Yes, the accident should have been avoided in the first place, but it isn’t worth a manslaughter charge because THAT part of the deal was caused by bad design.

  • L2C

    @ Trane Francks

    Maybe rear ending a Pinto wouldn’t warrant a manslaughter charge, lay the blame for that with Ford – but it would warrant the driver of the other car being charged with rear ending the Pinto.

  • @L2C: “Maybe rear ending a Pinto wouldn’t warrant a manslaughter charge, lay the blame for that with Ford – but it would warrant the driver of the other car being charged with rear ending the Pinto.”

    Which is exactly what many of us have been stating all along. Ding HRC for poor design that possibly cost Dani a championship instead of the incident being harmless (as it would have been on pretty much any other bike in the paddock).

    Anyway, you won’t see it differently and neither will I, so let’s just leave the discussion here. If I want to beat my head against a wall, I have a houseful of teenagers with whom to spar.

  • L2C

    It hasn’t been determined that HRC is at fault for a design flaw. Most are freaking out about it because it seems obvious that the TC cable should have been better protected, but hardly anybody is arguing that kids shouldn’t place their fingers in electrical sockets without expecting a shock!

    And, no, what most have argued, including David Emmett, is that Marc should not pay a penalty. All who agree on this point have said that the contact was slight and shouldn’t matter. Except the contact wasn’t slight and it did matter.

  • L2C

    Marc should pay for his part, is what I have said. You and others disagree. I’m sure if one of your teenagers are thrown from a bicycle because of a slight yet dangerous collision with another bicycle or vehicle, you would come to understand that situation better because up until now, you and Emmett and others are only arguing for what you want instead of for what actually took place.

    Marc should not have to pay for being involved in the accident is what you and the others have said. To me, this is inexplicable.